oh4theluvof (anonymous) says...

I'll gladly voice my opinion on this. The person who killed Dr. Tiller has no more respect for human life than they thought Dr. Tiller had. I feel so bad that this happened---his wife sitting in the choir watching helplessly........... it breaks my heart.
From a pro-life standpoint, this murder doesn't change anything on the actual abortion front. There are other doctors who are willing to do these abortions and they will. This does not save the lives of any more babies. All it accomplishes is to put a huge target on all pro-life advocates, most of whom don't deserve it (some do).
Speaking of the ones who deserve the target, I was told that Fred Phelps was to have a group protesting Dr. Tiller's church yesterday. Has anyone else heard if they were scheduled to or if they were actually there?

June 1, 2009 at 9:50 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

neighbor (anonymous) says...

They were there yesterday oh4, and I'm sure they will be there for sometime. I already added my two cents about this incident on the religious kooks thread.

June 1, 2009 at 9:54 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

powercat (Jerry Seinfelt) says...

The White House issued a statement Sunday evening from President Obama on the murder of George Tiller. Here's what the president said:

I am shocked and outraged by the murder of Dr. George Tiller as he attended church services this morning. However profound our differences as Americans over difficult issues such as abortion, they cannot be resolved by heinous acts of violence.

June 1, 2009 at 11:03 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

Hasasnak (anonymous) says...

All pro life claim to be "True Christians" and follow the Bible to the letter and how they conduct their lives. I think somewhere in that book, and , it is just a book, (don't tell me God wrote it, you don't even know what language He spoke) I read "Thou shall not kill". If this were true, there would be no wars and not one covicted person would be on death row. Now, a bible thumper will retort, what about "an eye for an eye"? My response is you can't have it both ways.

I've always thought, show me a Christian, and I'll show you a hypocrite.

June 1, 2009 at 12:30 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

history_nerd (anonymous) says...

There are hypocrites in every faith, Hasasnak.

June 1, 2009 at 12:47 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

Weltha (anonymous) says...

Posted by history_nerd (anonymous) on June 1, 2009 at 12:47 p.m. (Suggest removal)

There are hypocrites in every faith, Hasasnak.

and none faith.

June 1, 2009 at 1:05 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

open_eyes (anonymous) says...

Hasasnak, your statement is pretty much as narrow-minded and bigoted as they come. Do you also generally brand groups of people based on race? The "Godless Humanists" (to borrow the phrase from the "Religious Kooks" thread) ALSO claim to believe in peace and loving everyone. Yet they are also involved in wars and killing. So wouldn't that make them all hypocrites as well?
I've seen quite a bit of Muslim "hypocracy" going on in the world right now.
I've also seen Atheists cry "Oh God" when confronted with fearful situations.
Not only are there hypocrites in every faith, as history_nerd pointed out, but in every race, gender, age group, political group..... pretty much every single way you want to organize or categorize humans. Show me one of each of those and I'm sure I can show you a hypocrite (or 2).

June 1, 2009 at 1:05 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

history_nerd (anonymous) says...

"and none faith"

What?

June 1, 2009 at 1:18 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

Weltha (anonymous) says...

history-nerd- There are hypocrites in the proup of people who claim to not have faith, also. I was just adding to your post is all.

open-eyes- You said what I was thinking but am to darn lazy to type it all out.

June 1, 2009 at 1:23 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

history_nerd (anonymous) says...

Oooh, okay. Sorry!

June 1, 2009 at 1:25 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

Weltha (anonymous) says...

Its all good. I should have taken the time to clarify.

June 1, 2009 at 1:46 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

oh4theluvof (anonymous) says...

No Christian who spends any time in the Bible should ever come back with "What about 'An eye for an eye'," because Jesus refuted that Himself in Matthew 5:38-41 when He said, "38"You have heard that it was said, 'Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.'[g] 39But I tell you, Do not resist an evil person. If someone strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also. 40And if someone wants to sue you and take your tunic, let him have your cloak as well. 41If someone forces you to go one mile, go with him two miles.
Jesus also confronted the murder issue with this from the same Book and chapter: 21"You have heard that it was said to the people long ago, 'Do not murder, and anyone who murders will be subject to judgment.' 22But I tell you that anyone who is angry with his brother will be subject to judgment." He gave us clarification that we can be guilty before God of murder in our hearts long before or without even committing the act of murder. Yes, even Christians find ourselves guilty of anger and hatred that can lead to a murderous heart---whether or not we commit the murder. Our accountability is greater than that of the laws of the courts, but we forget that when we get caught up what we want to believe is just righteous indignation.
Also, the Bible was physically written by human hands by divine inspiration of God who speaks all earthly languages and more, not having our human limitations.
As for the hypocrisy, yes that is a trait of every individual on earth who inherited the sin curse no matter what they claim to believe.
I don't know who they have in custody or if that person and any co-conspirators claim Christianity, but if they truly are, they should expect the wrath of our nations courts and laws as well as to face the wrath of God for opposing His laws.
I hope that all true Christians show kindness and love to the Dr.'s grieving family.
I completely agree with our President about this, as I know many people do whether we agree with him on other topics or not.

June 1, 2009 at 3:11 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

open_eyes (anonymous) says...

According to the story, a couple of people at the church tried to confront the gunman and he threatened to shoot them. Somehow I don't think they were trying to shake his hand and congratulate him.......

June 1, 2009 at 3:34 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

Dido1969 (anonymous) says...

Well, well, well. We could say, “He who lives by the sword…”

Or we could say, “Chickens come home to roost…”

I’ve personally always been amazed that Jack Kevorkian went to prison and George Tiller did not, which says volumes about America.

Not being a Christian, personally, I'm not sure whether I believe there is a Hell or not…but if there is I rather imagine George is there now…or maybe he’s facing some sort of hearing and the jury is made up of the faceless entities that he denied life to.

I will not be a hypocrite and say that I was sorry to hear the news. I could never figure how he could have slept at night.

June 1, 2009 at 3:59 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

history_nerd (anonymous) says...

Kevorkian went to prison because what he was doing was illegal. Tiller wasn't doing anything illegal, whether or not you agree with it.

June 1, 2009 at 4:47 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

morajic (anonymous) says...

There are only three reasons I think of that could morally justify an abortion:

1. Rape
2. Incest
3. The mother's life is placed in danger due to the pregnancy

There are very few cases from the third scenario. Actually, there are very few cases of all three scenarios.

June 1, 2009 at 6:24 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

whatever (anonymous) says...

All three scenarios happen frequently, but regardless of situation, no one should dictate the rights of a woman to make decisions regarding her own reproduction. Personally, I'm more worried about the actual kids who are already here. How many stories of child abuse, neglect, and murder are reported daily throughout the U.S.? If people are concerned with the health of a unborn fetus, but not of a living child, what does that say about the "life is precious" argument?. If people want to save the lives of children they should foster, adopt, volunteer to help . . . but one person's reproductive health is not another person's business. Dr. Tiller was a brave man and I wish his family comfort for his tragic loss.

June 1, 2009 at 6:53 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

justthinkin (anonymous) says...

whatever - THANK YOU - Your post is the most straightforward I have read on ANY forum for a very long time. My Thanks to Dr. Tiller for the help he has given to many women. No one knows what brings a woman to make this very difficult decision, and I have often felt that if the woman makes the decision to have an abortion then she has to live with that decision for the rest of her life - not any other person - so no one has the right to condemn her decision. I repeat - Dr Tiller was a brave man and I wish his family comfort for his tragic loss.... and I add, I admire any person that puts his own life at risk to help another human in their time of need - which Dr Tiller did time & time again. God Bless Dr George Tiller.

June 1, 2009 at 7:29 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

seriouslyfolks (anonymous) says...

"If people are concerned with the health of a unborn fetus, but not of a living child, what does that say about the "life is precious" argument?"
So now if you are pro life you don't care about the living children? What? I know people who are pro life and are foster parents. They have adopted a few kids too.

My question to pro choice people is, Why don't you care about the choices that the baby never gets to make? If choice is so important, why abort 100% of one persons choices?

June 1, 2009 at 7:41 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

justthinkin (anonymous) says...

seriously.... what about Dr Tiller's choice to live ?

June 1, 2009 at 7:42 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

seriouslyfolks (anonymous) says...

As I said in another forum I am disgusted by the murder of this man. Are you assuming because I am pro life that I am happy about this. I am not! If you think you know me you better do some more thinkin'.

June 1, 2009 at 7:47 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

morajic (anonymous) says...

Unlike seriouslyfolks, I am not particularly disgusted with Dr. Tiller's death. I wouldn't go so far as to say that I condone murder at church (frankly I'm a little exasperated that he could even have face to go to one). What the murderer did was wrong, but I doubt God will punish him with equal vengeance as he does Dr. Tiller.

June 1, 2009 at 8:05 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

history_nerd (anonymous) says...

I believe that abortion is not an easy decision to make and therefore, we shouldn't condemn a woman for making that choice. Do I agree with abortion? Not necessarily. But I'm not going to tell a woman that she can't have one.

June 1, 2009 at 8:54 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

surprised (anonymous) says...

Wow. I’m so glad to see the posts by whatever and justthinkin. I thought I was the only Emporian who felt that way! After saying that, I will say that I accompanied a friend to Tiller’s clinic a few years back. It was everything, yet nothing like I expected it to be. First, I didn’t expect it to take all day! Security was great. And I was AMAZED by the different people I saw there. There were girlfriends with girlfriends, boyfriends with girlfriends, husbands with wives, and mothers with teenagers. They all had their own story. Some looked extremely sad. For others, it seemed like just a doctor visit. There were thank-you cards everywhere and through reading them, I realized what a great man Dr. Tiller was to have saved so many women’s lives (I think it’s interesting how some people see it as taking a life. I see it as saving a life.) I’m deeply saddened by Dr. Tiller’s death. It brought tears to my eyes and it must have weighed more heavily on my mind than I thought because I had a dream about it. It’s sad to know that one of the few doctors left in the states who did partial-birth abortions is no longer with us. And my heart and prayers are not only with the family and friends of Dr. Tiller’s, but his patients that were waiting for his services this week. I hope that someone helps them to quickly find the services they need, and the financial means to do it since they will have to travel.

June 1, 2009 at 8:59 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

create (anonymous) says...

I can only guess the sorrow and anguish involved when a woman decides on abortion. God bless and keep Dr. George Tiller for being available when those women made the difficult decision. May God bless his family and give them strength for now they must withstand this horrible time.

June 1, 2009 at 9:08 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

oh4theluvof (anonymous) says...

morajic said, "What the murderer did was wrong, but I doubt God will punish him with equal vengeance as he does Dr. Tiller."

Romans 12:19
Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord.

The person who killed Dr. Tiller usurped God's authority over life and vengeance to the same degree that Dr. Tiller had (with our permission) usurped God's authority over life. God is a just God and does not punish in degrees like we do. They both did wrong according to God's law, but only the shooter did wrong according to our law. If we had ever been able to get the laws changed to protect the innocent, I doubt Dr. Tiller would have gone contrary to them. If he had, he would have had that to face as well, but the fact is that he didn't. We the people are every bit as guilty of taking the lives of those babies as he was by our failure to disallow it. The killer of Dr. Tiller failed to take his moral outrage to the mirror first. God will judge that.

June 1, 2009 at 9:21 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

k_rogers (anonymous) says...

This AMERICAN TERRORIST ONLY HAD mental illness when it suited him, and he hides behind religion. COWARD !! This makes me sick. How many of you have been to dr tiller's clinic and seen first hand what goes on there. i have twice. His clinic is compassionate and caring and makes sure an abortion is truly what you want. We talked to a minister and several others inside the clinic (they work there!) and it took all day to make sure that this medical procedure was what the woman wanted. God bless Dr Tiller and his family and friends and his clinic employees who have to go on after this tradgedy. I don't like abortion, but i BELIEVE IN A WOMAN'S RIGHT TO CHOOSE. IT IS THE LAW, AND IT IS LEGAL. MURDERING SOMEONE IN COLD BLOOD IN THEIR CHURCH SANCTIONARY WAS NOT LAST TIME I LOOKED.......

June 1, 2009 at 9:32 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

open_eyes (anonymous) says...

From http://www.arizonarighttolife.org/ind...

A 1988 family planning survey detailed the following reasons as the most common:

I am unready for responsibility - 21.00%
I can’t afford a baby now - 21.00%
I am concerned about how having a baby could change my life - 16.00%
I don't want to be a single mother or I am having relationship problems - 12.00%
I don't feel mature enough to raise another child or I feel too young - 11.00%
I do not want to have any more children - 8.00%
My husband or partner wants me to have an abortion - 1.00%
My parents want me to have an abortion - 0.50%
I don't want people to know I had sex or got pregnant - 1.00%
Other 3.00% There is a physical problem with my health - 3.00%
There is a possible problem affecting the health of my fetus - 3.00%
I was a victim of rape or incest. – 1.00%

In conclusion, 93% of abortions are performed in America for social or economic reasons.
------------------------------------
I've found other more recent studies but they all pretty much mirror the same ratios. So abortion for health & rape isn't all that common.... certainly not "frequent"......

just FYI

June 1, 2009 at 9:42 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

oh4theluvof (anonymous) says...

"...........and he hides behind religion. "

I cannot find this reported anywhere. Does anyone have any links?

June 1, 2009 at 9:47 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

seriouslyfolks (anonymous) says...

James 4
1 Where do wars and fights come from among you? Do they not come from your desires for pleasure that war in your members? 2 You lust and do not have. You murder and covet and cannot obtain. You fight and war. Yet you do not have because you do not ask. 3 You ask and do not receive, because you ask amiss, that you may spend it on your pleasures.

June 1, 2009 at 10:17 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

methusla (anonymous) says...

I'm not touching this one, you wouldn't like what I have to say !

June 1, 2009 at 10:43 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

Truth (anonymous) says...

I do not condone violence against abortionists or their facilities. Pro-life people need to work through spiritual and legal channels to change the hearts of the people and the laws of the land.

Having said that, I wonder if people really understand what this person did for a living. George Tiller made his millions slaughtering unborn babies. All abortionists are murderers, but Tiller's method of operation was especially heinous. For a price, he would kill a baby at any stage of pregnancy, for any and every reason, or for no reason at all. In a partial birth abortion, Tiller would bring a baby to within inches of delivery before jamming his scissors into the back of its neck, suctioning out the contents of its skull and completing delivery of a dead baby. He was no "doctor" (doctors promise to "do no harm"), he was no hero, he was no helper of women-- he exterminated their children! He was ruthless and merciless toward poor, innocent, defenseless babies- a coward who sold his soul for the almighty buck.

God bless George Tiller?? Are you kidding me?!

June 1, 2009 at 10:53 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

oh4theluvof (anonymous) says...

I'd like to run a little scenario by all of you.

Homeowners frequently have too many nuisance birds in their neighborhoods, so they call on a guy who claims he can rid them of their problems. He gets good results, so he gets repeat calls and recommendations. He even sits and discusses with his clients the effect of birds on the ecology of the region to make sure it's what they want. One day, a resident is home while the man is clearing the neighbor's backyard of nests. The resident sees the man take a nest down and pick up an egg. He cracks it on an end and pulls out a pair of tweezers to pick the cracked shell off of the hole it covers. He pulls out another pair of tweezers and inserting them into the egg, he begins to pull a wing away from the breast it is tucked beside. As he gets the wing positioned, he has to get a better grip on it as the baby bird writhes and squirms to try to get away. When he gets the wing where he wants it, he begins tearing it from the body of the baby bird. The bird's beak opens wide in a cry that is silenced by the protein goo that surrounds the baby. The man continues to repeat this process, tearing off appendages of the baby bird until he has successfully removed the entire body from the egg and then repeats the whole thing on each egg/baby bird.
The appalled resident, not knowing what to do, watches in disgust as the man goes to another nest. These eggs are closer to hatching so he breaks away a portion of the shell. As the baby bird inside wriggles into the daylight, he shoves a sharp instrument into the base of the baby bird's skull.

Sickening? Disturbing? Psychotic?

Now, imagine these birds were humans.

June 1, 2009 at 10:53 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

k_rogers (anonymous) says...

To all of you posters and people reading . Look on the back of his car in the photos taken, and read his bio. The man in custody seems to be a very right wing nut who likes to ride around with explosives in his car, guns at the ready, and hates our government. .
ANOTHER THOUGHT: if you are so concerned about abortion why don't you adopt or take care of all the kids out there whose parents can't. there are millions of them. Put your money where your month is. We need foster care parents and adoptive parents for kids in the system now. Instead of condeming abortion why don't you help the ones we have. Have you ever thought about that????

June 1, 2009 at 11:09 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

k_rogers (anonymous) says...

TO: ohf4theluvof and seiouslyfolks and others: have you been to the clinic and seen this done?. Answer the question truthfully. Have you been there and personally witnessed it ? Have you had this procedure done?

June 1, 2009 at 11:17 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

Truth (anonymous) says...

k-rogers: Uh no-- I haven't witnessed a partial birth abortion, nor had one performed (huh?). The procedure is well documented and easy to research. What is your point? If you are denying this or any of the gruesome abortion techniques used to destroy babies I'd respectfully suggest that you need to do your homework.

June 1, 2009 at 11:24 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

Truth (anonymous) says...

k-rogers: Sure-I think about unwanted children a lot and thank God for the millions of people who want to adopt and who serve as foster parents. What I don't understand are people who seem to say that you aren't permitted to speak out against the murder of children unless you are willing to take them all in. That's ridiculous.

June 1, 2009 at 11:33 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

k_rogers (anonymous) says...

That is what i thought. You haven't seen one. Since you do your homework truth, how many of these are done in the wichita clinic every year?

June 1, 2009 at 11:35 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

seriouslyfolks (anonymous) says...

I have some friends who are expecting. They went to the doctors to see if it was going to be a boy or a girl. It was either a boy or a girl, no other options. A human boy or a human girl. Something to ponder.

June 1, 2009 at 11:44 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

alfalfa (anonymous) says...

I am thinking perhaps I would be better off not commenting, but this is such a incredible event in terms of the emotions it brings forth in people, I can't keep still. I am not fervently anti-abortion, I recognize there are some cases where it is the best option, but I feel it is overused and I get pretty offended at the diehard pro-choice folks that want to pretend a fetus is just tissue, sort of like amputating a hand. You can't get around the fact that what is aborted someday would be a human being no matter when you believe life begins. For that matter, clearly life begins at conception, whatever you want to call it from zygote to unborn child clearly is alive, so the real question is when does it become human? When it takes its first breath of air, when it can survive outside of the body, when? I can't be so cold hearted as to not care, and it isn't just the womans body anymore, there is another organism(if you want to reduce it to that) involved.

Both sides in the abortion issue get pretty far removed from rational thought. On other forums and websites I have read everything from "he got what he deserved" to "all Christians are crazy", ignoring the fact Tiller apparently was a Christian. Abortion is a terrible but sometimes necessary thing. George Tillers death is not right at all, but like many I am having trouble shedding alot of tears at this point. The entire situation is troubling to me, from late term abortions to Tiller being murdered. It shows clearly what a devisive issue this is, and how far we have to go to resolve it. A good outcome from all of this would be for both sides to resolve to do all they can to minimize the need for abortions, that seems a healthy compromise to me, but somehow I don't ever see that happening.

June 1, 2009 at 11:44 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

oh4theluvof (anonymous) says...

k_rogers:
No, truthfully, I would never step foot in that clinic because I don't really like feeling sick to my stomach and throwing up and that is all I would be able to do. As Truth pointed out, these procedures are not government secrets--they are very well documented (including video documentation) and confirmed. But as long as we're being truthful here, did you watch any of these procedures? Did you see what the Dr saw? Could you watch what his instruments were doing? Were you even in the room during the procedure, or did you just wait out in the waiting room to drive the fetus's host body back home? In all that counseling prior to the procedure, were the gory details of it explained?

I do not hate any of the participants of these abortions, but I do hate what they do and pity them for their ignorance.

I don't believe I will comment on this anymore as I was reminded by my beloved Grandma of her Grandmother's words: "The more you stir it, the worse it stinks."
I do not wish for this "stink" to stir up a wrong anger or misdirected hatred in me.

June 2, 2009 at 12:17 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

create (anonymous) says...

Whether the little scenario with the bird's egg has a human counterpart is not the point. The point is this: Abortion clinics are clean, sterile places that offer counseling. When laws are passed against abortion, they will still take place -- in dirty back-alley rooms where women die from infections. No need to go into gory details just for the sake of impact.

June 2, 2009 at 6:21 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

seriouslyfolks (anonymous) says...

I agree with alfalfa's point about reducing the numbers of abortions but I don't think that those that believe that there is nothing wrong with abortion would go for that. Why reduce the numbers of something that is good? It's just a procedure, right? Like getting your teeth cleaned. No one is against teeth cleanings so no one is trying to reduce the number of them. If people that are ok with abortion want to reduce the numbers maybe they're really not all that cool with it after all. Maybe there is a problem that is not the baby. Maybe some "preventive maintenance" is needed. Maybe we could get to the root cause of this. Maybe some of us are already trying. Maybe people aren't listening.

James 4
1 Where do wars and fights come from among you? Do they not come from your desires for pleasure that war in your members? 2 You lust and do not have. You murder and covet and cannot obtain. You fight and war. Yet you do not have because you do not ask. 3 You ask and do not receive, because you ask amiss, that you may spend it on your pleasures.

June 2, 2009 at 8:27 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

open_eyes (anonymous) says...

Mass of tissue:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sBWVSa...

or

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-uYDxZ...

June 2, 2009 at 8:34 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

goodoleboy (anonymous) says...

The bottom line here is this:

This man was doing nothing illegal. Let me repeat that again, nothing illegal. Reguardless of people's personal beliefs, what he was doing was within the limits of our laws and he was shot and killed.

It's black and white folks, reguardless of what you believe about abortion this was murder, there is no rationalization for it. Lets all live by the laws of the land until we disagree with them shall we?

June 2, 2009 at 9:34 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

seriouslyfolks (anonymous) says...

I agree goodoleboy but who here is trying to rationalize this murder? Perhaps I should go back and reread all the posts or you could point out all the rationalization for this murder that you see.

June 2, 2009 at 9:50 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

goodoleboy (anonymous) says...

The debate starts turning to abortion, rather than the issue itself, which is a man was killed for no reason. Abortion is not the issue here, murder is.

June 2, 2009 at 10:06 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

seriouslyfolks (anonymous) says...

goodoleboy
So there has been no "rationalization" on here and you misspoke(typed)?

These discussions tend to go in different directions. I'm pretty sure you yourself have gone off topic a time or two. Why the sudden concern now?

June 2, 2009 at 10:52 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

alfalfa (anonymous) says...

Abortion is the issue, he would not have been killed had he not been an abortion provider. I am not for even a minute suggesting killing Dr. Tiller was right, but you cannot seperate the two issues. Obviously he was killed for a reason, whether or not it was a good reason is beside the point. He was not the target of some random act, it was clearly planned. Anyway, take a glimpse at the Huffington post or any other liberal mouthpiece, the pro-choice folks are pretty sure it is about abortion, and us raving lunatic gun totin' far right Christians(probably should have added racist and sexist to that).

June 2, 2009 at 11:21 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

goodoleboy (anonymous) says...

There is no doubt why he was killed, I concede that point. What I have a real issue with is people like the killer who are driven to kill others for no other reason than the world does not bend to their will. Abortion is an issue that no one will ever agree on, why one side tries to convince the other is beyond me.

June 2, 2009 at 12:59 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

seriouslyfolks (anonymous) says...

I seem to remember a forum where to guys were in quite the debate on hunting. It seems a rather trivial thing to debate from my perspective but apparently to them in was very important. Perhaps the two sides of this issue(aborting babies) feel it is important.

June 2, 2009 at 1:14 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

seriouslyfolks (anonymous) says...

I meant "two guys" not "to guy"

June 2, 2009 at 1:36 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

methusla (anonymous) says...

Now I am going to make a comment that may be even more controversial than the "abortion" issue.
If for what ever reason after fornicating and becoming " with child ", I wonder how much thought was given to the actual end result of fornicating in the first place and whether either partner in the act was and is actually ready to take the resposiblity for the result of such actions !
If there are so many loving people ready to save these unwanted babies, why are there so many adoptable orphans and why are so many people adopting outside the U.S. ?
Now here is my controversial comment on the matter, " there is one option to abortion and that is " total sterilization of all ", then you will not be having a " pro-life" or " pro-choice " debate, you will be debating a different thing entirely ! You cannot satisfy everyone all of the time, no matter what you do or is done !
Murder is Murder, no matter who carries it out ! My point is, two wrongs do not make a right.
And the rehtoric that most of these pro-life project and use is very dangerous and borders on inciting a person or persons to take the law into their own hands !

June 2, 2009 at 5:21 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

open_eyes (anonymous) says...

k_rogers, since you seem to have the attitude that the pro-life group doesn't seem to care about adoption, I would like to point you to the many religious groups that aid and support adoption....

2007: White House Promotes Adoption through Religious Groups, Other Nonprofits

http://www.religionandsocialpolicy.or...

"Christian organizations and leaders are urging churchgoers to consider adoption as a biblical calling and as part of a movement to prevent abortion. Some religious groups say only the church has enough outreach, resources, and people to adopt the growing number of orphans. "

Or go to adoption.com and see how many of the adoption agencies are Christian affiliated. The pastor at the church I attend has 2 adopted children himself.

Your point?

June 2, 2009 at 10:30 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )