Helicopter painting project to be modified
By Bobbi Mlynar (Contact)
Originally published 09:01 a.m., May 17, 2008
Updated 09:01 a.m., May 17, 2008
Unanticipated obstacles are causing a change of plans for painting the Vietnam-era helicopter erected in the Veterans Memorial Park.
“As it stands now, we haven’t had any luck at organizing or getting it painted off-site,” said Ron Whitney of the local Vietnam Veterans group.
The helicopter’s three crew members, who were in Emporia when the helicopter was dedicated on Memorial Day 2007, in September had initiated a project to clear the Huey of a build-up of bird droppings and repaint it according to its original specifications. Much of the work, such as disassembling the helicopter — moving it by crane to a trailer, and hauling it to and from a hangar at the municipal airport — was to be done by volunteers.
One of the men, Ed Venable of Merritt Island, Fla., said in September that the three vets were trying to gain support from state and federal lawmakers to gain funds for the project.
Venable and the other crew members, Jim Williams and Gary Hennessey, originally had estimated the cost for a full restoration at $50,000. With volunteer labor and equipment, that cost was reduced to between $15,000 to $20,000.
Olpe school children conducted numerous fundraisers and raised about $450 toward financing the project, and one check was received from a private individual. The money is being kept in a specially earmarked fund by the veterans’ group until the problem is resolved.
The project, however, apparently will need to be modified, in part because of Environmental Protection Agency rules and the sheer magnitude of the effort.
“We’ve looked at all avenues on trying to put everything together to move this helicopter to a site that is capable of doing the paint, per the specs, and we have not been able to do that,” said Ron Whitney of the local Vietnam Veterans group. “From everything we’ve learned around here, there’s just no place to paint it that has the size or the capability or the space or the EPA requirements ... to do it here in Emporia.”
Whitney said that transportation is a major issue.
“You can imagine just how much is involved in trying to pick this helicopter up with a crane and set it on a trailer and so forth,” he said. The same problem would arise, in reverse, in trying to get the helicopter back to the memorial and re-seated.
“So, our Plan B is to try to determine whether we can paint it on site,” Whitney said. “... In the meantime, though, we do have plans in place on taking high-pressure washing equipment down there and scrubbing the helicopter down and getting the bird stuff off of it.”
Whitney and the local group will talk with the helicopter’s crew about the situation when the trio return to Emporia for Memorial Day activities this month.
“The paint job is not a dead issue, but moving it off-site to paint it does not look like that’s going to be a reality. Maybe painting it on-site could be,” Whitney said.
“No matter whether we get fresh paint or not, we’re still going to look into some things that we can do to reduce some birds from roosting on it.”
Comments
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Posted by zippy (anonymous) on May 17, 2008 at 11:09 a.m. (Suggest removal)
I am all for keeping the memorial in tip top shape but hesitate on transporting the helicopter off site to get it cleaned and painted. It was a massive amount of work to transport it to Emporia and then the set up. I would rather see that amount of money used for other projects at the memorial.
Posted by admireed (anonymous) on May 17, 2008 at 3:02 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Please, no federal pork. If we can not collect the $$$ privately forget it.
Posted by create (anonymous) on May 18, 2008 at 5:51 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Sorry Zippy, that money was earmarked for that particular project only. Let it sit and collect interest.
Posted by user4137aolcom (anonymous) on May 18, 2008 at 3:58 p.m. (Suggest removal)
I do not write comments as a matter of choice. However, in this instance, I will make an exception. I offer the following:
First, that ship is a Vietnam helicopter, not a "Vietnam-era helicopter". It has numerous bullet hole patches on her, had the tail boom replaced because of bullet holes and wrinkled skin panels, and had its transmission replaced when a .51 cal anti aircraft gun, shot out the upper left part of the transmission housing. She, is a combat veteran, the same as us. The South Vietnamese did not want her as part of the Vietnamization Program, because she was too badly shot up and beat up, for their effort. Hence, she came home with us.
Secondly, the money for her refurb, was to come from Mr. Hennessy, Mr. Williams, and myself. We did look for other sources and have found one, but the funding was essentially from us. That ship, deserves the best that can be given her. Any delta, which would not have been much, would be the responsibility of the City of Emporia. In this day of $4 dollar a gallon gasoline and the doubling of food prices (yes it happens in Utah, Arkansas, and Florida too), we understand a financial challenge to the wonderful people of Emporia. It is their choice on how to help. The Olpe kids did -- good for them.
Thirdly, the allegation that the EPA is an issue, can be worked. I was a production manager at Lockheed and senior staff to the Director of Launch Operations at Kennedy Space Ctr, and I know the EPA. It is a simple matter, of wanting to do it, not looking for a reason not to.
Fourth, the ship was put on the pedestal by the folks who cared enough to want to do it. With regard to transportation, it is not a problem. Mr. Williams owned a trucking company and can arrange for that to be accomplished at no cost to the City or its citizens.
Ghostrider 22.
Posted by user4137aolcom (anonymous) on May 18, 2008 at 4:03 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Ok, the rest of the note, Sorry about that.
Fifth, the ship is on loan from DOD, to the City of Emporia and the great folks who live there, We met many of them last year. The City is also responsible, for "maintaining the ship in an appropriate display configuration". It is our contention, that is acheivable if it is a desired goal. If it continues in its current state, the generations after us, and the citizens of a really nice area, will be the losers. Mr. Hennessy, Mr. Williams and myself, are all 100% Disabled Vets. We are walking medical enyclopedias for Agent Orange related issues, crashes, etc. We are a little emotional about this ship that saved our lives. I am sure there are many in Emporia who understand. But, it ultimately does not belong to us. It is the responsibility of the City and its wonderful people. We have offered assistance, but if is not for the good of the aircraft and the people of Emporia, 68-15652 will join us at the Good Lord's choosing when our time comes.
We will be there for Memorial Day. While the three of us are still able, we would not miss it. That ship and those of us who served, will be there to be thankful for the those who are still alive from Vietnam, and those from Emporia who are serving today. For those who are in the service doing their job as we speak, that ship and the three of us, offer our prayers and thanks.
Ghostrider 22.
Posted by user4137aolcom (anonymous) on May 19, 2008 at 9:55 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Hi Kstrebuchet. Painting the ship on site, is certainly an option. The issue however, is that this aircraft belongs to DoD and must be maintained in accordance with the appropriate military specifications. The purpose of moving it, was to provide cover to keep away dust, bugs, trash, etc. during the recoating process. There is a display Huey here, that had to be repainted when it fell off of its perch in the hurricanes of a few years ago. They "tented it" which could be accomplished in Emporia the same way if done appropriately. The important thing and it was true here, is that any recoating effort be in compliance with what the mil specs require. Otherwise, it a waste of time and could wind up to be a complete mess. This is an aircraft, not a car or a tank.
It is important to note, that the ship has not been repainted since she was rebuilt back in 1972. What we were proposing, is that she be recoated with a process that will leave her looking new 36 years from now, long after all of us are gone. In her current state, she will not last another 36 years.
Posted by user4137aolcom (anonymous) on May 19, 2008 at 12:27 p.m. (Suggest removal)
The ship is a DoD aircraft and can be taken back any time that the govt. feels it wants it (like it did with a number of other display Hueys in the last 3 years so they could be used in the war on terror) or "parted out". Non-flyable, has nothing to do with it being used for other applications. Or if they are not happy with the way it has been maintained, they can come take it away too. To say the specs are for "guidance purposes only", is a recognition that any coating process is appropriate, as opposed to one that will preserve the aircraft for future generations (e.g. roller and brush).
I could use any motor oil in my 400hp Mustang GT too, but if one establishes a standard for mediocrity, then that becomes the only standard that is met. The object of this exercise, is to leave the aircraft in as good a condition as possible for future generations, and for the people of Emporia to be proud of what they have created. It is not to subvert a standard by which anything is possible. If mediocrity is acceptable, mediocrity will be the result.
Posted by old_soldier (anonymous) on May 19, 2008 at 2:32 p.m. (Suggest removal)
OK, this may be a long shot, but there is (or was) a Chinook (CH-47) helicopter company at Johnson County Airport from the Army Reserve. I wonder if they would like a weekend drill "training mission" to sling load it to their airfield and use a hangar there?
I would hate to have the DOD reclaim this aircraft, as this was done with a former USAF jet that was at the airport in my last home. This was depressing, and the reason it was removed was because it looked like hell from neglect.
4137 - Would you mind if I contacted the unit and ask if they would be interested?
Posted by user4137aolcom (anonymous) on May 19, 2008 at 2:56 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Ok old-soldier, you are on. Any help will be appreciated. We are after all, outsiders trying to do something that is for the benefit of a City we do not live in, and for those generations in that City who will come after us. Sometimes it is hard for people to undestand how we feel. We accept that.
This aircraft has numerous bullet holes and other miscellaneous aircraft problems (e.g. bent main frame, tail boom replacement, etc). I know all of them, because I flew it and know every instance and incident where they occured. Gary, Jim, and I, are willing to gamble with our money for her sake, and for a City we only know from a visit. It is after all, a small price to pay for an aircraft that saved our lives and brought us home. A large number of folks who were in my flight class, were not so fortunate.
Be that as it may, we will be in Emporia shortly and will work the issues as appropriate. We very much look forward to seeing the friends we made the first time. This will play out how it plays out -- hopefully for the best.
Posted by navywife (anonymous) on May 19, 2008 at 5:05 p.m. (Suggest removal)
I'm writing this blog for my husband:
On my way back from Drill on the 18th of May, I noticed this article in the Gazette. After I got done reading the article, I was concerned with the heritage that goes with the aircraft. I too am in the military and our moto is "we take care of our own, whether its those that are with us today or those that have gone before us". This is why I have decided to volunteer to paint and restore the aircraft. I spent six years on active duty as an aircraft mechanic specializing in airframes, hydraulics, corrosion, and aircraft painting. While on active duty at my first command, I was responsible for the maintenance and painting of 2 helo's like the one that is on display in Emporia. I am certified in military aircraft paint and corrosion, I am very knowledgable in the military specs for the aircraft. If the City of Emporia approves, I can paint the aircraft onsite without any concerns of environmental dangers. I have located the exact military paint for this exact helo. If I am honored with the task of painting the helo, it will look just as good when it was brand new. I render these services free of charge.
Justin Klumpe,
Petty Officer 2nd Class USN
Emporia, KS
Posted by old_soldier (anonymous) on May 19, 2008 at 5:46 p.m. (Suggest removal)
4137,
I will contact them on the 27th when I return to town. If not them, I'll see if Ft Riley would like to get in on this. Feels good to have a mission again.
Are you guys going to be in town for Memorial Day?
Posted by user4137aolcom (anonymous) on May 19, 2008 at 6:19 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Wow! Ok folks, this would be super. The words seem hollow but we, all three of us, would be honored for Mr. Klumpe to do as he suggests. The City Manager and the Veteran's Committee have to approve it, but if this is possible, we would help fund it. And Kstrebuchet, Ghostrider 22 is a he, the former aircraft commander of this ship. Mr, Hennessy was its crew chief and Mr. Williams flew with her numerous times. Together, we probably have more flight time in her than all the other air crews added together. This would be terrific if it can be accomplished. navywife, we are on your side.
Ron Whitney, the spokesman in the article for the Veteran's Committee, will be our point of contact. He knows how to get a hold of us and owes us beer. And yes as noted in a number of the earlier notes, we will be in Emporia to see our friends, and our sister.
Ghostrider 22.
Posted by old_soldier (anonymous) on May 19, 2008 at 7:19 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Sounds like Mr Klumpe is the way to go! I wish I could help, but the only thing I ever sprayed on an aircraft was firefighting foam.
Posted by Hillbilly (anonymous) on May 19, 2008 at 9:04 p.m.
(This comment was removed by the site staff.)
Posted by Hillbilly (anonymous) on May 19, 2008 at 9:17 p.m. (Suggest removal)
furthermore, it is great to see some people like Mr. Klumpe and Mr. Old Soldier who actually care and want to get involved in a worthwhile project.
I wish the helicopters crew a safe journey to Emporia to see each other and their ship.
"Duty - Honor - Country -- It's One Thing To Say It -- It's Another To Live It." ~ unknown
Posted by create (anonymous) on May 20, 2008 at 4:04 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Way to go, Justin! I will play my harmonica for you while you paint.
Posted by user4137aolcom (anonymous) on May 20, 2008 at 7:23 p.m. (Suggest removal)
HI Create. With respect ma'm, play Gerry Owen. The ship would appreciate it. Our best. You have been very supportive.
Posted by navywife (anonymous) on May 20, 2008 at 9:49 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Hello all, this is Justin Klumpe. I have located the exact paint for the helo. Unfortunately they quit making the color in the 80's. The mil standard changed to a different shade of green. So I need the opinion of the crew on the color that closely matches the original color. I can't match the color to the color of the helo due to fading over the years. So I need the crew members to go to
http://www.ipmsstockholm.org/colorcharts...
This is the federal color standard for paint. Scroll done until you find the numbers 34094, 34088, 34095, and 34050. Once you find the number just click on it and it will show you the color.
I haven't heard from anyone as of yet. I am still hoping that I will be able to honor those that have served by painting the time honored aircraft.
Thanks for all the support,
Justin Klumpe
Posted by user4137aolcom (anonymous) on May 21, 2008 at 6:13 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Good morning Justin, this is Ghostrider 22. I got notes each, from Mark McAnarney and Ron Whitney yesterday. They and or the Veteran's Committee, are to be in touch with you this week. My two crew chiefs will be there Friday (Hennessy and Williams) and both Mark and Ron can provide you the location where we are staying. Gary and Jim can give you any additional data you may require.
I looked at the colors and 34094 seems to be the closet. The color on there now was what the Army put on her when she was rebuilt. The O.D. brown IR resistant paint was supposed to help against SA-7s., but we survived without it and we will be glad to see it gone.
Justin, what you are doing for the ship and the people of Emporia, is beyond wonderful. When we are out there, we will take steps to help ensure you have everything you need.
22.
Posted by create (anonymous) on May 21, 2008 at 6:39 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Good Morning, Ghostrider. I looked up "Gerry Owen" and it looks like it's a 7th Cavalry fighting song. I even found a site where a guy from Missouri is singing it. I hope I have the right song because I also found all the words and the music. Let me know if I am correct.
http://maxhunter.missouristate.edu/0396/...
Posted by user4137aolcom (anonymous) on May 21, 2008 at 10 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Hi Create. You are accurate. It is the famous song of Custer's 7h Cavalry, originally an Irish drinking song -- go figure why the Cavalry would like that. It was adopted as the division theme song (the 7th is a regiment of that division) by the 1st Cavalry Division in the early 80s. The unit we flew for, 60th Aviation Co, 1st Aviation Brigade (Ghostriders), was originally Charlie Company, 227th, 1st Cavalry Division, but became the 60th when the Cav went home. My compliments ma'm. The following url will give you the "lyrical version".:
http://www.us7thcavalry.com
Posted by navywife (anonymous) on May 21, 2008 at 11:44 a.m. (Suggest removal)
I just wanted to say that I am so very proud of my husband. It takes a very special person to VOLUNTEER their services for such a large project.
I love you baby,
Selena
Posted by create (anonymous) on May 21, 2008 at 2:04 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Thanks for that link, Ghostrider. I listened to that familiar song and loved it. Yes, I can see playing it for Justin as he paints that bird. It's a bit of a reach for harmonica, but I've almost got it. Wish I played a bagpipe. Maybe we can record it. The tune is a bit different than the one on the website I looked up earlier. I enjoyed reading all the history. Thanks again.
Hey Selena, I know you have more computer smarts than I have, why don't you cut a CD of that song off the website Ghostrider provided.
Posted by ghostrider22alpha (anonymous) on May 21, 2008 at 2:05 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Hi create,,,,Even now at 60 yrs old,I am still having to correct my aircraft commander,,, it was not the 60th Aviation Co,,,,It was the 60th ASSAULT HELICOPTER COMPANY,,,what ya'll are doing brings tears to my eyes, but don't tell Ghostrider 22 ,,,I'll see ya'll Friday night,,,
Posted by user4137aolcom (anonymous) on May 21, 2008 at 2:24 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Crew chiefs, you can never trust 'em. Everything has to be exact.
Anyway, we went thru several battalions of the !st Avn Bgde, as the folks went home. But, Jim is right about the name he provided. However, I believe with the last battalion, it was the 60th Avn Co. (Combat Assault), 1st Avn Bgde. Most of the Internet web sites including "Vietnam Order of Battle, list us as the 60th Avn Co.
Navywife, we, all of us, are on y'all's side. As noted earlier, we will do all we can to ensure success.
Posted by create (anonymous) on May 21, 2008 at 5:43 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Oh, by the way, may I say that I am the widow of a Marine air winger, Da Nang and Chu Lai. I love seeing that helicopter down there at Soden's Grove. I can even hear the wop-wop-wop every time I look at her. Bless you all. Oh yeah, I taught Justin and Selena English in high school. Just a few connections.
Posted by midnight_rider (anonymous) on May 21, 2008 at 8:21 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Ghostriders - How exciting to see all of the positive comments here about getting the ship brought up to the standards that she deserves. Enjoy your stay in Emporia.
GBU/GBA
Posted by Hillbilly (anonymous) on May 22, 2008 at 8:33 a.m. (Suggest removal)
hey user, who checked the fuel in the tanks?? you think that he was checking the chopper to make sure YOU got back to the house? NOPE,, he was doing all that stuff so that HE would get back!!!!!!!!!! ....lol.... Have a safe trip to Emporia
CLEAR LEFT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
you guys are "NUMBER ONE"
Posted by user4137aolcom (anonymous) on May 22, 2008 at 11:44 a.m. (Suggest removal)
I see Hillbilly was a crewchief also. Thanks for your sentiments Hillbilly -- see you shortly.
Create, our deepest sympathies on your loss. We, all of us, understand the challenge that comes with that. Anyway, we flew mostly in II Corp from LZ English in the north, to Phan Thiet in the south and west to all points in between. There was an occasional trip to an area that was off-limits, and words don't need to be said for that. I spent about a month in Chu Lai for reasons that are unimportant and your late husband (one 'a us which makes you an honorary "one 'a us"), may have mentioned some of the following: Tam Ky, Happy Valley, Quang Nghai, Million Dollar Hill, LZ Ross, etc. Hard to believe I can remember all that like it was yesterday, but cannot remember what I had for dinner 2 days ago.
Justin knows how to get a hold of us and if we do not hear from you, we will be at the Memorial on Monday. We will be the forlorn looking commodities, that are dressed in Vietnam Veteran regaliia and lost as usual. We would be honored to meet you, ma'm.
22
Posted by create (anonymous) on May 22, 2008 at 12:38 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Thank you for your thoughts, Ghostrider. I will be there on Monday, you can be certain of that, and I will look for you. Have a good trip.
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