City wants Station 2 cost study
By Joey Berlin
Originally published 01:14 p.m., January 10, 2008
Updated 01:14 p.m., January 10, 2008
Whether it’s rebuilt or simply repaired, Fire Station No. 2 is likely to cost the city a fair amount of money. The city commission is willing to spend some cash up front to find out which direction — repair or rebuild — will be the least costly route.
After a discussion of Station 2’s myriad problems at Wednesday morning’s biweekly study session, the commission told City Manager Matt Zimmerman it wanted to solicit bids for a study of the cost of building a new station versus making repairs to and expanding the existing station. Zimmerman estimated such a study would cost $15,000 to $17,000.
Fire Chief Jack Taylor, who analyzed two potential new sites for Station 2 last month, also participated in Wednesday morning’s discussion.
Zimmerman said that following Taylor’s site analysis, the next step was to see exactly what the city wants to do. Zimmerman reviewed the 29-year-old station’s problems, which he said were not only structural, but also included the original design of the building.
“It has to do with the fact that the world of firefighting has changed significantly in the last 29 years,” he said.
Problems discussed included the building being too small, not having enough bays for emergency response equipment, the absence of modern, equal sleeping quarters for male and female firefighters, mold/ventilation and the building’s leaky roof.
Last Friday, Zimmerman and Commissioner Jeff Longbine toured the station with Bill Whetzel of Markowitz Builders, which originally constructed the building. During that tour, Zimmerman and Longbine said, Whetzel formed what Zimmerman called “his own un-expert opinion” that the footings and foundations were the only structural problems with the building.
As a result of what he saw, and Whetzel’s view as a builder, Longbine is skeptical that Station 2 is in as bad of shape as the media has reported and community members perceive.
“For the community’s sake, the building is not falling in,” he said. “I don’t think the building is nearly as bad as community members think it is. There are cracks, there are problems, those type of things. But I think in any 30-year-old building in Emporia, Kan., you’re going to see some of that.”
Longbine also said he didn’t understand the problem with the female firefighters’ sleeping quarters, based on the fact that the department has just one female now. Station 2’s men’s dorm has six beds; across the hall, the separate bedroom has one bed for the female firefighter. Both sexes have their own separate baths.
Taylor told the commission that the informal standard in today’s fire departments is that sleeping quarters are individualized, with each sleeping cubicle separated so firefighters can turn on a reading lamp without disturbing others, or avoid being kept awake by snoring. He said current and previous female firefighters at Station 2 have complained about hearing the male firefighters laughing and talking in the other room, making the female firefighters feel left out.
“When they’re in individual cubicles,” Taylor said, “everybody is equal.”
Zimmerman added, “Because you not only have to have that camaraderie, particularly in emergency services, but the perception becomes that you’re not being promoted because you haven’t developed those working relationships. ... That’s why the standard now is to have sleeping quarters with individual cubicles so that everybody is equal. And then you have separate washrooms, obviously.”
Taylor envisions a new or repaired Station 2 that has enough bays to store emergency response equipment, so that the department no longer has to place some equipment outside. He said he would like eventually to move headquarters to Station 2 to free up space at Station No. 1, which is also cramped.
Zimmerman said he wants to hire an independent firm with both architectural and engineering expertise, because he’s heard questions from community members about why the station is in such bad shape after just 29 years.
“Is it something that’s standard because of the typical Kansas soil and Kansas weather,” he said, “or were there other design issues, or were there other construction issues? And we don’t know the answer to that question.”
Commissioner Bobbie Agler said Station 2’s problems represented a critical situation. But Longbine’s view was that it depends on how “critical” is defined.
“Jack may argue with me on this, but I have seen nothing in that building that is affecting our ability to provide service to the community,” he said.
Longbine agreed that a study was necessary to figure out what is critical and what isn’t.
Last month, Taylor analyzed the Public Works area and a site west of Dryer Park as potential new locations for Station 2. The Public Works site was deemed to be the more viable of the two options because of better response times, but Taylor sees Station 2’s current location as the best site of the three.
justthinkin (anonymous) says...
Here you (Commissioners) go again. Another consultant & another consulting fee. Seems to be plenty of money to give to "experts" rather than believe what our own employees tell you. But then, you show your City employees so little respect or appreciation, there's no reason to be surprised.
January 10, 2008 at 4:19 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Renegade (anonymous) says...
Unbelievable!!!!!!...Can our City Manager, or our Commissioners make ANY decisions on their own? Or do they have to hire a consultant, or independent firm, for everything?
I would hope that everyone pays attention... and when it comes time to vote, take all this into consideration.
January 10, 2008 at 7:43 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
disgruntledcitizen (anonymous) says...
Whats not said here is that the women's dorm is supposed to be the Captain's dorm which means when there is a female firefighter on your shift the captain doesn't get his own dorm. Also it means that there can never be two females on the same shift. Also the Captain at station 2 doesn't even have his own office or computer. He has to share with everyone else and can't have private meetings or a private computer. No these aren't that big of things but its just a couple more small things to add to the list which in turn maked it all a bigger problem. Also every new station you go to every firegihter has his own dorm and bathroom which makes for some privacy, as some guys and gals snore really loud, or some got to bed really early, or some like it very cold in their bedroom, some like it hot, some like to listen to a radio, etc.. Like I said, not a huge problem but just something that needs to be reviewed. I have mixed emotions on bringing in a firm to do a study. In some ways it is good because you have an outside point of view and someone who is familiar with firestations around the world and on the other hand that is a lot of money to waste just for someone to tell you that you need to build new or rebuild.
January 10, 2008 at 8:32 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
slipandslide (anonymous) says...
i agree the fire house needs repaired or replaced, it should meet the needs of a fire house and to be comfortable enough for workers to be rested is important for those who do the kind of work efd does.
January 10, 2008 at 11:33 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Renegade (anonymous) says...
slipandslide, and I agree...but, let the commissioners figure it out and take responsiblity for what gets done in Emporia. Apparently, they are asking for a raise.....
Until they can make a decision on their own, and figure out how to agree on something, unanimously.....without bringing in outside help...like high priced consultants.. they will not get my support, or my vote in the next election.
I agree, our firefighters, and first responders everywhere, should be paid fairly, and have proper living quarters.
Maybe if the commissioners cancelled the contract for $70,000 for the retail consultant...they could put some of that money towards either rebuilding or repairing the firestation.
Sorry.....Everytime I read all of the forums...I see something about a consultant, or someone from outside our community coming in to help.....and now, the commissioners want a raise.
January 11, 2008 at 9:32 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
old_soldier (anonymous) says...
Individual dorm rooms are for more than just comfort and privavcy. They help prevent the spread of colds and other ailments. These fire and EMS people come into contact with "sick" people daily. They may not come to work sick, but they may wake up that way. Perhaps Longbine would like to go on a few EMS calls where people have vomiting and diarrhea blasting out both ends, fever of 101 and they cough on you?
Even the Army has realized this, and is doing away with big groups in open bay barracks for long term housing. Station 2 is a piece of crap and I've been in it, BUT I have seen worse. I do believe that if they were to rebuild it, they'd have to move everyone out anyway because of the amount of repair needed. Truck bay floors, walls separating, HVAC replacement, kitchen upgrade (they should have COMMERCIAL grade appliances) sleeping quarters overhaul, etc. Where would they move the fire and EMS folks to while ALL this is done? A differnet station? PROBLEM SOLVED! Build a new one! That'll be $5,000 for consult please (a bargain!)
January 11, 2008 at 10:11 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Pollyanna (anonymous) says...
What we hear about Emporia civil servants such as Police, EMS, Fire Depts, is that turnover is high due to people finding better wages, better living conditions, whatever. Ultimately saying Emporia's conditions/wages are sub-par. Everyone on these forums continue to praise our Fire Dept and value their courageous expertise. I say let's make this an opportunity to create a modern, appropriate new facility for ALL to thrive in. Male or female. I also understand with this comes additional taxes, but I'd sleep better at night knowing the people who may have to come to my rescue some day have been in a safe, comfortable, healthy living environment while away from their families. Eventually if we value and provide for the fire dept the way they deserve, we will see less turnover and more qualified individuals serving our community.
January 11, 2008 at 10:54 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
lycomu (anonymous) says...
I am certain it does not take a consultant to identify the problems with the Police and Fire departments. It seems quite basic that a strong Police/Fire department attracts new citizens and business. Honestly, if we as a community cannot provide the best enviroment for those who protect us, then why would we expect those brave men and women to stick around?
January 11, 2008 at 11:05 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
dhcc66 (anonymous) says...
did anybody happen to catch the fact that the comissioners toured the station with the "original builders"????? now...does anybody see a problem with that?
of course the original builder isn't going to see anything wrong with their product. geez....why not have a structural engineer from topeka or wichita look at it...not the person who built it
January 11, 2008 at 1:28 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
dhcc66 (anonymous) says...
ok wait. i've got an even better idea. like somebody up above said, why not ask the comissioners to work a full week at station 2. wake up when the medics do, go to fires in the trucks. sleep in dorm room conditions.
oh, and while we are at it, why not have them also consider riding along in the patrol cars that they purchase for the pd officers?? they surely could sit comfortably for up to 8 hrs in the passenger side of a Chevy Impala...right?
if they are not willing to put themselves in the place of the people they are equipping, then maybe we need to ask ourselves why won't they....
ponder that for a while
January 11, 2008 at 1:42 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
slipandslide (anonymous) says...
its amusing to think about commissioners working a shift to find out what its like, they would find a flimsy excuse to leave early, considering how this town is run, its a good chance they will use the same builder and repeat the experience of having a dilapitated building within a decade, dont think they learn well from experiences
January 11, 2008 at 4:01 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )