lookup (anonymous) says...

These days the average cost of spay is $100+ for a medium to large size dog. A savings of $10 is great, but what about the people who can't afford the other $90? It's not much motivation for those that really need it. It only benefits the people who can really pay the full price anyway, just looking for a coupon. The Humane Society would really be helping more if they offered a bigger discount to the truly needy. This is just a "feel good" promotion.

September 27, 2007 at 11:22 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

petlover (anonymous) says...

Kinda like children, cars, anything else. Why have them if you can't afford the basic costs. Don't expect someone to subsidize them just becuz you "want one". Responsibility is fundamental and expected in many things. I guess being "rich" today is anyone not on govt. support in some peoples eyes.

September 28, 2007 at 7:50 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

create (anonymous) says...

Petlover: "Kinda like children, cars, anything else. Why have them if you can't afford the basic costs." Easy to say.

You aren't alone in your opinion; many people feel the same way, but you can state your opinion on that one until stones turn into butterflies. It still doesn't change reality. People who can't afford children/dogs/cats/cars still have them and still don't take responsibility for them. Sometimes they are the victims of temporary circumstances.

You say that responsibility is fundamental. If that is true, then why must we have so many agencies and social services? Just yesterday KVOE sponsored a huge food drive to stock the pantry at the Salvation Army. In addition to leaving the usual goods on my porch, I also remembered to leave a package of dog food because I know people who need help to feed their families very likely have dogs/cats to feed too. It's a fact of life.

I agree with lookup. Animal groups should give a bigger discount if they really want to seriously help people who can't afford to spay pets. If not, it's just another Big Fat Deal.

September 28, 2007 at 8:53 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

offc_grl76 (anonymous) says...

Most of the Vets here in town will let you make payments on your vet bill. I am not a "RICH" person by any means. I have over $200,000 in medical bills from cancer, but I am a pet owner that has my dogs spayed/neutered. Do I think this makes you a responsible pet owner--NO. I think making you a responsible pet owner is making sure your dog's are not running loose anytime you want, cleaning up after them, caring for them by giving them the basics, food, water, shelter. AND trying at all cost to only let your animal reproduce if you can guarantee that they will have good homes to go to.

September 28, 2007 at 3:41 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

Church_of_doG (anonymous) says...

Every night in the Gazette under the notices it reads "For the prevention of cruelty to children and animals, the Humane Society of the Flint Hills, 620-342-4477". Since children are listed first, are they connected to the SRS office? How many calls do they get concerning cruelty to children... What does this mean? Guess I'm confused....
If you want your donations to REALLY support the animals locally who need fixed, donate to the Buck Fund spay and neuter program. Flat fee of $45 for all who have household incomes below $32,000.

September 29, 2007 at 12:26 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

Heartland_Rescuer (anonymous) says...

P.S. to Church of DOG and anyone else interested in lower cost spay/neuter........

Buck Fund's spay neuter program for lower income pet owners is a YEAR ROUND assistance program. I donate to the organization really bustin' it to make a difference in this community all year round in all areas related to pets.

September 29, 2007 at 1:24 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

ksfarmer (anonymous) says...

"The Humane Society of the Flint Hills and the H. Dale Buck Fund are separate entities with similar goals — making life better for people and animals. Support for either supports both."

This "blanket" statement about support bothers me.

All my money is earned by working very hard all year long, so when I choose to donate to a group of any kind I want to know how my money is being spent. A CPA told me about a way to check non-profit groups out. www.guidestar.org

All I do is register my email address and I can look up any non-profit charity anywhere. I can look at their IRS forms and see for myself where their donations are being spent, and just how much is being spent each year in my community. I can read about them and decide for myself if my money will be put to work the way I intend it to be when I write a check.

Talk about an eye-opening experience! Very helpful web site. And basic registration is FREE. Allows me to look at their IRS 990, review their goals and obectives, etc...

www.guidestar.org

September 29, 2007 at 1:36 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

sciguy (anonymous) says...

Thanks for that Guidestar link, KSFarmer. Useful stuff.

I see the H. Dale Buck fund is listed. They've been tremendous help to my wife and I in adopting our pets.

September 29, 2007 at 4:06 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

lookup (anonymous) says...

kstreb.... did you click on the humane society 990 form? $361,000.....spent $795? talk about an excess

September 29, 2007 at 5:15 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

petlover (anonymous) says...

After seeing ChurchDog's post & checking the classifieds in the gazette, I googled children & humane society. The American Humane Association comes up..."Protecting children& animals since 1877". Maybe our local "Humane Society" with their concern for cruelty to children needs to change their name to "Humane Association of the Flint Hills". The Humane Society of the US makes no mention of prevention of cruelty to children. Could possibly a member of the local organization explain this. Too deceiving for most people. The HSUS points out that local HS remain independent entities with their own policies & priorities. Aren't there enough government agencies looking out for children? Why does our local HS choose to include them also? Animals with no voice need an organization who chooses to use the title of "Humane Society" their full attention, not children. CHANGE THE AD! Too misleading.

September 29, 2007 at 6:27 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

ksfarmer (anonymous) says...

Actually, you have to pull up the organization by the proper legal name "Humane Society of the Flint Hills" Emporia KS. Their 2005 IRS 990 shows a net asset base of $361,496.00.

Then if you scroll down to program service accomplishments on the form it shows that in 2005 they spent $295 on their humane education program, and $500 to Hurricane Katrina Relief. Spent a total of $795 on their programs in 2005.
I'm sorry.... With that kind of financial backing this organization could be doing SO MUCH MORE in the Emporia community helping the Emporia Animal Shelter, etc...

Pull up H.Dale Buck Animal Welfare Fund, Inc. Their 2005 IRS 990 shows a net asset base opf $173,903.00. And under program service accomplishments it shows their adoption program/spay neuter of pets at $13,878.00. Something else their page shows is a mission, what they've been up to for the year, and a complete list of their officers, AND the fact that they have an independent audit performed each year.

Doesn't look like the 2006 reports have been posted yet. I know I will be checking to see when they are posted by the IRS.

September 30, 2007 at 12:33 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

MelissaE (anonymous) says...

I love that all these "non-profits" somehow make profits at the expense of the taxpayers in the community.

Nice.

M

September 30, 2007 at 3:21 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

Firecracker (anonymous) says...

Has anyone stopped to think that if a "non-profit" corporation actually operated at a loss that they wouldn't be around long enough to help ANYONE? They have to stow some donations back for the years when they simply don't get any big donors........ The economy affects them same as it does "for-profit" businesses. Difference between "non-profit" corps and "for-profit" corps? Simply put - "for profit"corps have a business that actually earns revenues. "non-profit" corps do not. They use donations (yes - funded SOLEY by donations) to help their target populations. Thing is, you have to review and observe what the organizations are doing in the community. Put the dollars and the service work in the community together to form an educated opinion.

Maybe if the city was as fiscally responsible as charities are required to be there would be plenty of taxpayer dollars being spent on their responsiblity of providing public health and safety services.

October 1, 2007 at 8:45 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

create (anonymous) says...

Firecracker, I am not opposed to non-profits stowing some funds back for rainy days, but using the Buck Fund as an example, spending only 13% of your funds is far too little. I think non-profits should be required to spend a higher amount of its funding.

October 1, 2007 at 9:43 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

Firecracker (anonymous) says...

So write them a letter and ask them specifically what they are saving their $$ for.

Any reputable non-profit will openly share their audited financial records & internal statistics with the public provided the request is in writing. I'm sure there will be more information in the 2006 990's once they are posted on guidestar too...................

October 1, 2007 at 2:59 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

ksfarmer (anonymous) says...

TO greenday> What are you talking about in your comment from October 1st? I don't understand............

October 1, 2007 at 3:03 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

create (anonymous) says...

tre, you put it into good perspective with your comment about the Buck Fund having enough funds for 10-12 years were they to have no donors. I'm with you, these agencies are not spending enough on what they purport to believe in. That needs to change. Perhaps the problems they like to tout as being serious occurences would be less serious if they were to spend a proper amount of money on solutions to begin with. I don't think people would donate as much if they knew about these rainy day funds.

October 1, 2007 at 5:38 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

PetAdvocate (anonymous) says...

Kstrebuchet, create, why don't the 2 of you get the whole thing? The Buck Foundation has put the donations they have received to helping spay or neuter ( $45.00) for low income, which is about a 1/4 of the cost and they pick up the balance of the procedure, they adopt out FULLY vetted pets who are spay and neutered. Lets say 2005 was a good year for donations and 2007 not so good, they still are out there to help and it's a GOOD THING there is money there to help. Flint Hills Humane Society should take lessons from the Buck Foundation on how to really HELP. greenday, contact the Buck Foundation and get an apllication to help you alter your pet.

October 2, 2007 at 2:21 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

Weltha (anonymous) says...

It does kinda suck to be right on the cusp of being to poor and not quite poor enough. I'm not just talking about the pet issue either. I've been in the same boat before greenday.

October 2, 2007 at 2:35 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

create (anonymous) says...

PetAdvocate:

I'd be happy to try to "get the whole thing" if you explain what you said here because I don't understand what it says. How much exactly is the Buck Fund paying ? $45.00 then pick up the balance of the procedure. How much is that totally?

"The Buck Foundation has put the donations they have received to helping spay or neuter ( $45.00) for low income, which is about a 1/4 of the cost and they pick up the balance of the procedure, "

As I said before, I'm not opposed to rainy day funds as long as agencies spend more than 13% of their funds. 13% is not enough. How about 20%. That's one-fifth. I can live with that. They still have 80% to carry over.

October 2, 2007 at 2:49 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

PetAdvocate (anonymous) says...

I would be happy to do that research on vetting costs and I will get back to you shortly.

October 2, 2007 at 3:16 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

PetAdvocate (anonymous) says...

This isn't about policies and whether or not you agree with them or rainy days. It is however about having the funds to totally vet an animal and /or helping to spay or neuter, ( there really is an endless supply of unwanted animals to be taken in that really do deserve proper vet care and a great home),
educational programs for children and / or adults. I really do not know why the Flint Hills H.S. doesn't foster or adopt or rescue animals and they have all that money in the bank. I do know from adopting a pet from the Buck Foundation that this is what was spent and it cost a lot more than the adoption fee and consider if this was just a low income spay, they are still paying more than 1/2. This is on a small dog and the bigger the dog the more it costs.
SPAY/full vetting for female canine under 20# (This dogs adoption fee was $150)
SPAY under 20# = $119.50
Fecal Exam = $23.40
Rabies Vax = $17.00
Heartworm Antigen Test = $31.00
DHLPP Booster/annual = $25.00
Drontal Plus wormer = $11.35
Bordatella Vax = $15.00

TOTAL SPENT canine/female = $242.25

October 2, 2007 at 9:25 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

PetAdvocate (anonymous) says...

It costs so much to have an animal vetted and spay or neutered here in Emporia. I have lived in another state where vets actually gave a discount to rescue groups and (individuals who had more than one pet, even up to 30%.) Also when a pet is is foster care the Buck Foundation not only pays for spay/ neuter, and fecal and vaccinations and heartworm tests and feline leukemia and aids testing, they also provide preventatives such as heartguard and frontline and special food if needed or medication as some animals coming in are in poor shape. I just don't believe that the Buck Foundation is just hoarding money for a rainy day. I can't wait to see what their stats are for 2007 especially compared to the Flint Hills H.S.. Now that you have me thinking about it I really want to know why the Flint Hills H.S. has so much money and is only offering $10.00 discount for spay and neuter once per year. Why aren't they helping the person who doesn't quite meet the low cost spay and neuter program that the Buck Foundation offers? Why aren't they doing a free vaccination day? That would help us all. I heard they are building an education center, why not a real humane society that houses, adopts and fosters animals. That would sure cut down on all the pets that go to these high kill so called dog pounds. You did get me thinking about why does a so called Humane Society not have any animals and all that money in the bank. I don't think they are even on the same level or page as the Buck Foundation. I was also thinking that if there was more help for people and animals some policies wouldn't even be needed. Thanks for making me think.

October 2, 2007 at 10:41 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

lisag (anonymous) says...

Just for the record, I think the humane society offers their $10 "discount" twice a year. And don't forget the "Hay Giveaway" should be coming up soon (altho most people realize straw is better).

October 2, 2007 at 10:53 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

lisag (anonymous) says...

Oh, one more thing to think about, Why would any good business spend 20% of their assets when their investments only make an average 10-12% interest? I'm not an accountant, but it doesn't seem smart.

October 2, 2007 at 11:03 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

PetAdvocate (anonymous) says...

I'm sorry, do you think that the Flint Hills H.S. is doing a good job helping the community with 2 $ 10.00 a year spay coupons and hay? What do you feel they should do with all their donations. I think they should help more in the animal field. I'm all for a free vaccination day or build a shelter. That would help alot of people and animals that could really use it. I would really just like to see them help where it really counts.

October 2, 2007 at 11:16 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

Church_of_doG (anonymous) says...

Maybe they could spend some of that money & turn the gas chamber room into a low cost spay/neuter room & use lethal injections. For the love of doG, they call themselves the HUMANE society!!!

October 2, 2007 at 11:27 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

PetAdvocate (anonymous) says...

what a fantastic idea. A spay and neuter room. Are you serious about the shelter having a gas chamber when fatal plus injection is so much easier and quicker on an animal who has to go to heaven and it is not costly. WOW why doesn't Emporia have a Humane Society? I hope no one ever gives them another penny. Flint Hills you should be a shamed of yourselves.

October 2, 2007 at 11:38 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

PetAdvocate (anonymous) says...

I don't think I was clear on what I was saying earlier. when it cost say $119.50 to spay a 20# dog and you make 32,000 or less a year you can get that spay for $ 45.00 and the Buck Foundation pays the remainder of the bill. The bigger the animal the more the vets charge, but you still only pay $45.00 and the Buck Foundation pays the remainder of the bill. This is a year round program and they offer it in several counties.

October 2, 2007 at 11:49 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

Church_of_doG (anonymous) says...

petadvocate, you didn't know the local shelter prides itself on being one of the last places in KS to use the gas chamber? When they bult it, they even asked the architect to make that room sound-proof so the howls of the slow dying doGs would be muffled. Throw 'em in, push the button & walk away. No muss, no fuss. It's easy, any $8 an hour employee can do it! And they wonder why they can't get any good employees! EIGHT DOLLARS AN HOUR! Who would want that job? Get real city officials, police dept, whoever is in charge of the salaries.

October 2, 2007 at 11:53 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

PetAdvocate (anonymous) says...

That really saddens me. How they can call that humane is beyond me. There is no excuse for using that gas chamber when lethal injection is available.

Flint Hill H.S. why don't you help fund the shelter so they can do the right thing by these animals? Why don't you help with salaries and fund some training and help with some foster care at this shelter? Why are you not helping????????

October 3, 2007 at 12:09 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

create (anonymous) says...

PetAdvocate, thanks for the explanation I had asked for earlier. Now you have made it more clear about the $45.00.

October 3, 2007 at 11:14 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

PetAdvocate (anonymous) says...

You are welcome, maybe you can spread the word about the low cost spay/ neuter program from the Buck Foundation, so more people can get that help. Not everyone makes more than 32,000 a year, I know I don't. I know the advert. was in the paper once, but nothing better than word of mouth. I say let people use the funds that are there for them and the Buck Foundation is willing to help. I still don't understand why Flint Hills H.S. is not using their funds and they have ALOT. 360,000 in 2005 and all they are doing is a 10.00 coupon twice per year. That's where our focus needs to be.

October 3, 2007 at 12:48 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

Heartland_Rescuer (anonymous) says...

TO lisag > When you said, "Oh, one more thing to think about, Why would any good business spend 20% of their assets when their investments only make an average 10-12% interest? I'm not an accountant, but it doesn't seem smart."

I am an accountant by trade and NO it would NOT make sense to spend more than your investments are bringing in. Also, folks need to understand that many times donors who contribute to non-profits give what are called "RESTRICTED GIFTS". This means that those donations can only be used for certain things as approved by the donor. Some donors give stricly for spay/neuter. Others give strictly for "buildings/adoption centers", etc... When a non-profit receives gifts of those types the $$ have to be "reserved" until such time that there is enough funding to build the building or start the program whichever it might be.

AND P.S> a "little birdy" told me that the Buck Fund offered to do a spay/neuter project with the Humane Society to benefit the animals at the Emporia Animal Shelter. Humane Society turned them down. They did not want to spend any $$ on the shelter animals.

October 3, 2007 at 1:31 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )

PetAdvocate (anonymous) says...

Now I get what you were saying lisag.
Thanks Heartland_Rescuer. I still do not understand why Flint Hills H.S. are not doing there part. I don't understand how they can even call themselves a Humane Society. I bet the HSUS would be ashamed of them too if asked.

October 3, 2007 at 2:29 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )